Activism in the Workplace with Shei Mamona

This week, Shei Mamona joins to talk about activism in the workplace. She shares how she first began writing articles with an activist lens and how she stays true to herself when choosing new projects and opportunities.

You can stay connected with Shei via her website, Instagram, or LinkedIn.

Direct article links mentioned in the episode can be found below:

• Wigs (first published article)
• Rejection Therapy
• Fenty Hair Salon Review
• Amazon Hair Salon Review
• Megan Thee Stallion Interview
• Tracee Ellis Ross Interview
• Escaping Ukraine

Make sure to subscribe to Hold the Door on your favorite listening platform. You can also get updates on guests, episode releases, and more by following the show on Instagram @holdthedoorpod.

Transcript

Shei: And these are the same people, some of these people were telling me that I yap, yap, yap too much. And now look at me yapping away. 

Camille: And getting paid to do it. 

Shei: And getting paid to do it, period.

Camille: So, speaking of, well, this is a bad segue, I'm going to delete that.

Shei: Like, it'd be crazy if such strangers just came up to me being like, babe, I love all your black lives matter stuff, but it's a bit weird that you write about it all the time, don't you, don't you just want to branch out a little bit, you know what I mean?

Camille: Hello, welcome back to hold the door. I'm your host Camille Wilson. This week, Shei Mamona joins to discuss activism in the workplace. You'll learn how she first began writing articles with an activist lens, and how she stays true to herself when choosing new projects and opportunities.

Shei is an award winning freelance journalist with bylines and publications such as Vogue, Teen Vogue, Glamour, The Sunday Times, The Telegraph, Marie Claire, amongst others. She is a maths graduate who now writes about beauty, sports, entertainment, and racial equality. She has also been a guest host on BBC Woman's Hour and has experience hosting panels on some of the biggest stages such as the Web Summit, Wired Summit, Glamour's Empowerment Summit, Amongst others, her visibility and work have earned her a highly commended award at the British Society of Magazine Editors Awards, BSMEs.

She spends a lot of time snowboarding and is part of Technically Doing It, TDI's management team. The biggest pro black and brown snowboarding crew on the planet.

Hope you enjoy our conversation.

Alright. Let's get started. Shei, welcome to the pod. Thank you for joining. 

Shei: I'm so excited 

Camille: I'm excited too because I feel like this where I feel like we're talking about a topic that So many underrepresented folks have to deal with in some way because when you're like the only one Or one of like the only people in the room who is different.

You can often become the spokesperson for everyone or like voluntold into like, into an unpaid DEI role for your team or for your company. And sometimes it's a double edged sword. Like it's great to be able to talk about the injustices that are happening around you and your workplace, but it's also a burden or can be a burden if you haven't made the intentional decision to do so.

Um, but in your case, you did. make a conscious decision. So let's chat about how you got there. So, um, we heard your career bio. And so now to kind of contextualize who you are in the world to the listeners, we'll hear your personal logline. 

Shei: Okay, so I'm, I'm getting so nervous because everyone's personal logline is so freaking cool.

Camille: Also, you're the only guest, you're the only guest so far that has actually heard an episode at all before, before recording yours. 

Shei: Well, you know, I'm committed to the cause. Thank you. Okay, so, I'm a Portuguese black woman who identifies as a Jackie of all trades, master of some, who thrives off organized chaos and is on a mission to complete as many side quests as life allows.

Camille: Bam. Period. I love it. And actually that's true, like the side quests you've already done, it's crazy. 

Shei: It's actually so crazy and every time I, sometimes I'm actually, I went through a phase that I was like embarrassed. I would just feel like people wouldn't take me seriously. I'm on a consistent, I always feel like, If you're in a game, like you want to get to the end to the final boss as quickly as possible without losing as many as the least amount of lives as possible.

Right? That's the aim of the game. And me, even as a actual gamer, like when I used to game as a kid, I always loved side quests and I would waste my lives on side quests because they would be so much fun. And in my real life, I literally do do that shit. I'm literally wasting away lives doing dumb stuff.

on the side and having the time of like the time of my life. So sometimes I'm like embarrassed when I'm telling people like my new little adventure that I'm on, but I've just kind of like learned to embrace it now. I'm like people know I'm crazy. Let me just. live life as I want it, as I want to live, you know.

Camille: A hundred percent. And definitely not a waste. Also your side quests, like when you say you're interested in something, you want it, you have a new hobby you're thinking about. It's like, it's not like, oh, I'm thinking about knitting. Here's a little sock that I made. It's like, I'm flying across the country.

I'm going here. I met with this person. I'm at a gala. Like those are your side quests. 

Shei: Wearing the crochet dress that I just made. I'm actually working on a new Christmas dress right now. See. Yeah, that is very accurate. Exactly. I take my side questing very seriously. I want to finish the quest and usually by finishing I mean I everything that I kind of put my mind into.

I like I want to be somewhere at a place that I'm like proud of myself and like my standards are super high for myself. So it means I invest quite a lot of time on my side quests. side missions, basically. And it's a good, it's a good thing because like, I think that's what helps people take me a bit more seriously because they know when I'm trying like a new thing, they're probably like, yeah, she's probably going to nail that.

So I probably shouldn't judge her. And it makes me feel better. I love 

that evolution. 

Yeah. It helps me sleep at night, so. 

Camille: Hey, whatever helps. Um, okay, so I usually start by asking if entertainment was always the plan and how you got into the industry. But I want to start with you by clarifying if you would still consider journalism and the beauty industry as part of the entertainment industry or if you're, if there's just major overlap.

Shei: Definitely consider it as fully part of the entertainment industry like what we do is for entertainment like beauty is not saving lives unfortunately like we are not like, I'm sorry, but it's PR not ER. So like very much entertainment like it's not by force. It's very much for fun. And in a way it does change lives because it, you know, self esteem, I feel like, you know, changes people's lives and that's how entertainment can change lives.

Right. But yeah, I, my industry is very much part of entertainment. So yeah. 

Camille: Nice. So how was getting into the industry always the plan and how did you end up there? 

Shei: So, no, it wasn't.

Like, I, so, as you know, I'm Portuguese, born and raised. I moved to the UK when I was quite young, to be fair. I was probably, like, 13, I'd say. And, um, 12, 13, 14, I can't remember. But, I, obviously, English is my first language. And I always had, like, a really interesting connection to, like, I've been watching, this is so nerdy, I've been watching, like, CNN news since I was, like, 10.

I don't know. And it was before I could speak English. I just thought that the anchors was so freaking cool. I was just like, these are bad. Like these are bad. Wait, wait. 

Camille: Did you say English was your first language or your third? English was not my first 

Shei: language. 

Oh, okay. Okay. 

Shei: Which is not my first one obviously.

Yeah. 'cause I'm Portuguese. Okay. And I'm Portu and I only learned English when I moved to the uk when I was like in my teens, in my early teens. So I just always had a fascination with like journalism and I wanted, I kind of was super curious about it, but I'm also like, as much as I am Portuguese, I am African too.

My parents are black African and they do not play when it comes to our education. And I really didn't want to be like the disgrace of the family and not pursue something like, I don't know, a bit, a bit more like traditional, like medicine, you know, engineering, you know, law. So I, Went through school and I did really well.

And then I went to university, I guess, college for y'all. And I studied math and I, it was actually mass operational research and statistics. And I only really did it because I was like, kind of good at it. It wasn't like any passion behind it, but I deep down inside, I always knew that I wanted to be a journalist.

And at the time I'd never even considered pursuing journalism in any capacity, whether it was broadcasting, writing, or anything.

Cause I just knew I didn't even want to do a writing degree because I didn't think I'd be good enough for it because of my English. So for me to go from a math degree to, um, journalism is a crazy side quest. And I, and then it turned into like my life. I graduated, I did some retail management. That was a crazy experience, which you know all about.

And I've written about it. It's very cathartic for me to write about that experience. I definitely, I didn't leave the industry because of racism, but I, it was a big factor in me deciding to pursue something that I actually loved and enjoyed instead of pursuing something that I knew how to do. So then I, when I left, Retail management.

I went back, I came back to Portugal and then I just like lived with my sister and like was interning at like PR agencies. Cause I was trying to figure out how to like transcend from PR to journalism. And I tried to do journalism internships. I couldn't get anything. And then one day I DM'd, um, this, uh, beauty director, she was at the time she was actually, I think she is now back on the role.

She's like Vogue's beauty director at large. I think, and her name is Femi Fetu and she was, she's a black woman and in a super high role in the biggest magazine, one of the biggest magazines in the world, the British Vogue. So then I DM'd her and not thinking she would actually reply, but I literally was like, Hey, like, I'm a big fan of yours.

Like how can I do what you do? And she actually replied and gave me a bunch of tips. I then started kind of like following through the bullet points of things that she'd advised me to do. And about six, I'd say six months into like actually putting in the work to try and get my first BT internship, I did that.

And like, I haven't stopped working since. Like, and that was in 20, I want to say 2019 or 2018, and that was like the start of like, my side quest becoming like my main, like, life goal and income. So yeah. 

Camille: Amazing. Okay, I want to know, what made you send that DM? Even though you thought she wasn't going to reply.

Cause I think I would be like, well, that's a waste of my time. I'm so embarrassed. Like it's going to be, if they ever see this, it'll be embarrassing. It's embarrassing for me to see it in my feed that was sent. Like what made you do it? 

Shei: Do you know what's so funny? I have a bunch of. unanswered DMS right now in my life that I'm like, okay, it's been years.

I probably should go to back to that person's DM and like delete it because it's so embarrassing. Cause now they'll see me in like an event and then they'll be like, Oh my gosh, you're that fricking loser that was DMing me back in 2017. And then I'm like, no, like I should be proud about the fact that I was bold enough.

to ask because if you don't ask you don't get and i think that like i there's been it's so funny you asked me that because i literally every once in a while i'm like damn i know i dm'd that person and it's probably a good time to delete it now because they never opened it so there'll be you know no love lost And I don't necessarily like need that help that I asked at a time, which was basically advice and necessarily need that advice so I could delete it.

But I just feel like that is such a beautiful part of my journey. Like, remember, it reminds me as well when people DM me or email me or link or send me messages on LinkedIn, which I need to be better at replying, by the way. But when I do do reply, I really do go out of my way to help people because had it not been one or two people that like, it.

That had no loyalty, no loyalty to me whatsoever, but had they not taken the time out of their day to just be like, you know what, like, I feel like it'd be a good idea for you to try this. Had it not been them, maybe I wouldn't be here today. And it'd be so nice to be able to pass it forward to other people.

And this technique so far hasn't really let me down. So I don't really have any plans of changing it. So I'm going to keep DMing people and be shameless about it because So far it's worked out okay, you know

Camille: yeah. Okay. Sorry. Getting us back on track. So when did you first become aware of inequality and representation and treatment within the beauty community? Was it like in that retail management time period?

Got those internships, got into the more journalism side of your career that you started seeing like, mm, something's not really right here. 

Shei: Um, so I've always like been ultra aware of like my surroundings since I was a kid and I used to be in debating society in school. Like it was like my favorite. One of my favorite things I like one minute I'm in the Beijing Society next minute I'm going to athletics training like track and field and like next minute I'm doing netball next minute I'm doing something else like musical theater like I was doing everything but Beijing Society was so fun because I'm so interested I was very like politically orientated and I was very aware of like my existence and how it was perceived in the world and I've always been an only like since primary school already in primary school I had like A handful of black friends more so than I did by the time I got to like When, by the time I turned in my teens, when I was in my teens in school, I barely had any black friends because of where I grew up.

So I've always just been aware of that stuff. And like, I've never been like disillusioned by the fact that like, uh, D D I is an issue in Western society and all the things that I want to like that I'm interested in don't have people that look like me as much, or when they do, they might not have the best experiences.

So that's how I started. Since I was young and I've always been aware of that. So by the time I got to my teens, late teens, I was like jaded completely and everything, every move that I made in my life was based on the, was based on proving people wrong, which is definitely not the approach that I would, I wouldn't change my, my trajectory to now, but it's not a It's not necessarily like how I would operate moving forward now.

I don't move forward in the world feeling jaded and like just offensive. Um, but I, I, I spent my late teens and my early twenties super jaded by my experience as a black woman and always wanting to fight the man, right. And the machine. So going into beauty, I knew exactly what I was facing. Nothing was. It was surprising.

Um, it was more so frustrating. It wasn't surprising. And I was there on a mission to try and make things better. That was like my goal. And I wanted to create diversity in our industry and just put my little 1 percent into creating change. Um, and that's like, that was always my goal. And I feel like, um, I, I feel like I put in at least, you know, a 0.

001 percent into it and that makes me feel good. 

Camille: No, for sure. I think it, I think you can get a higher percentage than that. Um, so when you were always aware, but when did you first think like, I want to speak on this? In a real way, because it's one thing when you're like talking to your friends and family about like, oh, this happened or whatever, but it's much different when you're like, I'm gonna do this on my platform and be really like public about it.

Shei: My first story that I got published was when I was at the Sunday Times. They have a magazine called Style and I was the beauty assistant then and I pitched a story about Black women wearing wigs because in, in like, I mean the paper is very like right wing and very conservative and the audience that reads, you know, usually that paper don't necessarily have the knowledge that, you know, our community has.

So I wanted to like say, you know, like, Because I knew that there was so, I always talk to my friends and my peers and my cousins and my aunties and they always had a funny story about wearing wigs and going to work and people being shocked and like sometimes appalled by the fact that they had hair and wore wigs and they just were completely unaware about the fact that you can wear wigs for styling purposes as opposed to like for health reasons or you know or for religious reasons right.

So then my goal was to write this story for people that don't know nothing about our culture. And I knew I was going to get backlash for it because that was like, that's the industry that I'm in. And that was the readership that we had, but it was really interesting because Within a week, there was another writer from Ireland that had written, you know, she was a Caucasian woman, that had written a very similar story, but hers was about hair extensions, and you should see the drastic contrast of commentary on both pieces.

It was insane. Like, my comments were either like, she should wear a hat, this is why women are insecure, Like, why do they need this? She's, you know, she, um, this is weird. Well, all her comments were like, oh my gosh, wow, I need to try this. This is amazing. Like, and I mean, I don't even want to comment any further on this because like, if I speak, they will say I spoke.

But it was just a true reflection. If you actually read the stories. And you understand where I'm coming from and where she's coming from. I'm coming from like a historic, I kind of talk about the culture. I kind of talk about our, the importance of hair in the black community and especially within women and about Afro hair and it, all the delicacies of it and how to manage it in Western society, what is deemed appropriate in the workplace.

It was so, it was so nuanced. And the other piece was about hair extensions. So just sit with that. Because the fact that everybody completely overlooked all the nuances that came with the story that I wrote to then in rush to comment negative things instead of like helping me celebrate my heritage and for that other person to write the story within a week.

So it wasn't like, you know, society has evolved. Society didn't evolve in a week, babe, but like, we're very much still the same. Our values are still the same. And yeah, that was like the first time that I, like, I tried it and experienced it and I almost expected it. I was, what's, what do people say? I was, I wasn't surprised.

But like I, I don't know. I was just irritated. I knew it was going to happen, but it still annoyed me. 

Camille: Yeah, totally. So, knowing this would kind of happen, but still thinking it was important enough to do, What, at that time, when it was still fresh, what were you imagining, like, would be the result in your career?

Shei: Oh, I got a story in print, which, like, getting a story in print at that stage of my career, which was super early on, this was a couple of months into journalism, in the biggest new paper in the country, had teachers from school messaging me being like, why am I having my morning coffee on a Sunday?

Picking up my newspaper, and I see your face on it. And these are the same people, some of these people were telling me that I yap, yap, yap too much. And now look at me yapping away. 

Camille: And getting paid to do 

it. 

Shei: And getting paid to do it, period. So that was like, one of the benefits of it was like, I wanted to write something that was like, I knew that was going to be provocative because it would get me the byline in the first place.

Like, to secure a byline, it was hard. And when you're new and when you were a system, it's hard. You usually, you are, it's very much. I don't want to say it's devil's product because different publications have different things, but like you are very much doing a lot of like lunch runs. Okay. And for me to spend my time doing writing in my first job was so invaluable.

And I was scared to do it. I was so anxious because I was like, I really don't want them to think I'm bad because this will decide the rest of my career, I already dropped. everything else in my life, this is it. So if my writing is bad, then like, I was kind of like hiding in the shadows. I was like, I want the byline, but at the same time, if I don't have it, it's good.

Cause then I can keep hiding. It was like a double edged sword. And so when I pitched it, I was confident in the fact that I knew it was going to do well and it did super well. So we have this chef called Nigella Lawson and she's super, she's like a Gordon Ramsay type level woman here in the UK.

And then she had her column that she posted in her socials with like millions of followers and my story did bigger numbers than hers did that week. So, and I had 2000 followers at the time, you know, so clearly I knew that it was going to be something provocative that people would want to click on it.

And it was educational and I did have good comments too. And I had people reach out to me. I've had, had the opportunity to feature like a black owned hair salons who saw genuine like increase in traffic because of the story. They messaged me being like, Shei, like, I had three clients come to me this week and I asked them where they saw the recommendation.

They said it was from a story that you wrote to the Sunday Times. And I was like, wow, like that's three more people that didn't hear about this woman who started a business in the last five years. And now she has three new clients because of my recommendation. They took my opinion and then decided to go spend money because of it.

Like, I feel like. That those things make it worth it like that the fact that I got my first byline and also like it was cathartic As I said, like I enjoy writing about my experiences in my existence and regardless of how people feel about it I'm still good. I'm gonna feel always good about sharing my story

Camille: it's really cool that you were able to see your impact immediately. With getting clients, people reaching out and being like, Hey, I saw this thing, like, that's really awesome, especially on your first article.

So I'm glad that even though you got a ton of negative comments, It was still encouraging and it wasn't just a completely negative 

Shei: experience. For sure. After that I was like, okay, let's go again. And I didn't play for ages because it's super hard to pitch. And I couldn't think of anything provocative and I was super new and I wasn't like, I was very like green, you know, so like I needed more experience but like I was excited for the first time.

Camille: So true. Um, so colorism. I want to talk specifically about colorism. So,

um, just asking about your experience. So it's colorism is obviously like super pervasive in society, but especially in like beauty and entertainment. And I think In the past few years, we've, as a society, started to become, maybe not necessarily become more aware, but at least there's more conversation about it, where they'll be like, Oh, we shouldn't have cast this person because, you know, if we were true to the character, like the person that was based off, they should have been darker skinned.

So, um, what has your experience been with colorism, like as a black woman in corporate, but then also as a journalist, and then at the same time, you're a consumer experiencing this in the world.

Shei: So super interesting. I feel like. Colorism hasn't been like, so backstory, my mom is mixed race, so she's incredibly fair. She's got very curly hair. So naturally me and my siblings came and, you know, you know, a mixed bag of shades, but both of my sisters are super light. I'm definitely the darkest skinned in my family, aside from my dad.

And so my experience is. As growing up as a black woman, I'm very different than my sisters and my mom, and I do remember in my teens, kind of like, understanding that my experience was different, and then trying to explain it to especially my mom, and she didn't quite get it.

And honestly, like, shout out to my mom. You know, like moms are awesome and she couldn't, she wouldn't be able to understand it because she's never lived in a body like mine. So it was only natural that was going to happen. But one thing I will say that my parents did that made me feel very confident growing up.

Like I, my parents always taught me that like my intelligence. Is my currency, but I'm also extremely beautiful and that's okay like to admit that they were like, you know what you are gorgeous woman, and you're going to hear that a lot growing up, and it's so funny because obviously I didn't, but they were like, they were, they would be, you know, like, only in my, only in my 20s when I, You know, society had evolved by then.

I'd obviously moved to like more diverse spaces, but like growing up, I didn't get told that I was beautiful by people outside of the black community. Black people told me I was beautiful all the time because we celebrate each other and we're really good at doing that. But because of that, my experiences in terms of color, like involving colorism, didn't really affect me in any kind of way.

Because as I said, my colorism tends to affect you more within your own community. And I didn't experience that because Yeah, I had a really good circle around me, right? As I got older, I realized, and then when I was starting to have those conversations with my mom and my family, like I was starting to feel like there was like a lack of understanding.

So then we would educate each other on things and then we'd move on and move forward, right? And I never really became resentful of like my, you know, skin color. I don't think I've, I probably had a one week stint in my life that I wanted to be light skin like ever in the last 30 years. And I would have been like, you would have been so cute if I was like a light skin body.

And then that lasted a good, like, I don't know, 72 hours or like something. And then the rest of the time I was like, I love my chocolate skin. I get told it every single day by my parents at home. That is the most gorgeous thing ever. My mom tells me how envious she is. And I just didn't think any, I just, I thought that my parents, whatever my parents said was Bible.

So even when I heard it outside, I didn't believe people. And that's that when I became older, I realized that that definitely was a thing. But then I also realized that being black in general, it's, it just makes things so much more difficult.

And I didn't want to fight two battles. Like I was like, I really just want to focus. There's so many things in life that we as women, for example, like there's so many things that I'm passionate about, and that I know that so many injustices in the world. But I just realized that there's only so many battles I can fight.

And I just wanted to like really focus on the fact that like we need to change the narrative when it comes to black women but I never really overthought the idea of like the fact that I'm like dark dark skin and some people would even say that I'm not like some people would say like oh no you're like more brown skin or whatever and you have very European features da da da and that even even that makes me feel like who am I to sit here and yap away about all the injustices you of being a dark skinned black woman when, honestly, like, I'm one shade away from being mixed race.

Like, I don't have the stereotypical features that people usually associate with dark skinned women, and I understand that with that comes also certain privileges, right? So I am aware of that. And I also am aware that like, there's definitely opportunities that I've lost based on the fact that like, I don't have a lighter skin tone, but there's just so many battles that I need to fight.

And I just didn't feel like that was one of them up until this point. And hopefully that will never be one of them because I've really, I've seen the struggles that my sisters and my mom have been through. And I'm like, I can relate to that. And I'm like, okay, well, they're going through stuff as well. So we just need to unite and fight this battle together, you know?

Camille: Yeah. And shout out to your parents, because I think a lot of parents, they have the goal of empowering their children and kind of giving them the shield to the world.

But I think sometimes the world is just. It's so aggressive and intense that the shield is just not strong enough, but it sounds like it really was for you. Like they, you had that trust and love with them that you're like, no, no, no, I know what's true and it's what they say. And I can kind of like fend off all this other stuff that's happening around me.

Shei: This is so real. I wrote a story for Refinery29 for the, for Unbothered, and it was about rejection therapy. And I've spoken to a psychologist. She's actually a homie. She's one of my friends and she. She's a therapist and she was talking about the fact that like, um, and when it comes to like rejection and as existing as a black woman, like if you wanna ex, if you, if you experience a rejection therapy, the only way that could be a good thing is if like the good voices louder than the bad.

And she was saying about like, some people will experience. the same voices at home as they do outside, which are bad. And then that's what kind of like rejecting therapy is not effective for them because they're being rejected in all spaces. And then they start believing it and internalizing it. While if you have really good experiences at home, and then you have that relationship, and then you have that understanding that maybe those voices are more important than any other negative voice, then that's when it becomes like a good sort of like, I don't know, like a good learning experience.

to expose yourself into rejection. So she was like, you were very lucky to have experienced that at home. And I do know that like, I always grown up really not doubting my beauty and also really just focus on that's probably why I've always been so loud about my achievements. I get very triggered when people make assumptions about my intelligence.

That's one of the things that I'm working on because it doesn't. It also doesn't matter if somebody thinks that I'm dumb, like it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what anybody thinks. But that's the one thing that would trigger me because I don't care if you think I'm ugly or if you're not attracted to me, it doesn't matter because guess what?

Nine times out of ten, I'm probably not attracted to you either. But like, um, but like, I always wanted people to really know that I'm intelligent because I knew that that was my currency. And that's something that is like, you can't argue about that. It's not, right. You know, like it's not intelligence is not in the eye of the beholder is like very much like it's a statistic, right?

It's a number, right? So like, I don't know, like I always like triggered me. But yeah, it definitely home learnings was super important. And like one day when I saw my own family, I think that would be like my main goal to make sure that like I create an environment when my Future children can feel that like they're important and they matter and they're beautiful and smart and intelligent and all that stuff because it made a difference in my life.

Had it not been that, I don't think I would have been who I am today. I would have been a very miserable, bitter child. Human woman, wrong woman. 

Camille: Oh, Oh, love them for that. Um, and I have, I have the same sensitivity about intelligence. It is like, so triggering to me when not even when people explicitly say I'm like, I don't think anyone's really explicitly said it, but I'm like, if you just hint, you don't think I know this or you don't think I can figure it out.

I am. That will set me off. 

So once you'd been working as a journalist for a while, you had a few stories under your belt where it was like, okay, talking about black hair, talking about black women's experience in the workplace, talking about the wage gap. And so once you did have a platform where people are expecting you to kind of share these stories, did you feel the burden?

To speak on behalf of others who didn't share your identity, but had a similar life experience of being part of a marginalized community. And you're like, okay, well now I'm the voice of. Everybody in the margins or were you like, no, I can have boundaries. I can separate and I can, like you said earlier, choose my battles.

Shei: So, yes, I did feel the, it's not that I felt it, like it was almost expected of me. But the second part to your question is no, I didn't. I didn't. I felt the pressure, but I didn't like sit on it. Like, I didn't. I remember when the war with like Palestine and Israel started to come up and actually even before that so like the whole Russia Ukraine thing was coming up.

Like at work there was so much pressure for me to have an opinion on things. And people would actively go out of their way to force me to have an opinion on things and to say like how I feel or if I had any angles to stories. And it's like, my title is Beauty Assistant, or I guess at the time I was Beauty Writer.

So, it doesn't really, like, that expectation shouldn't be there, shouldn't have been there in the first place. I understand that we are a team that writes about news, but like, that expectation wasn't asked from the picture editors, you know? And from the entertainment director. So, like, I feel like, definitely, It's throughout my whole career, like throughout the last few years of my career, especially when I was in house, mostly like, obviously, and now I'm freelance, I do what I want, but like when I was in house, the more I would write about something, the more expectations for me to have an opinion on anything really mildly related to it would be there.

I just didn't, as I said before, I'll say it again. I'm happy to say when I don't know about something or when I want to pick my battles, I'm so more than. Open and happy to tell you that, like, my capabilities don't reach that far, and And also it's very heavy to be like, put in that bubble, like I want to like live life softly too, you know, like, I don't know, like there was definitely that expectation.

I didn't fall back to it though. I'm just here to do like what I, You know how to do and what I feel passionate about doing and what I think will be beneficial. Like I don't think sometimes it's beneficial for me to speak on, like, I honestly don't want to steal the platform of people that are marginalized.

I know way more about their experiences than I do, like, well, you know, what business do I have? I'm talking about issues that, you know, like when I could give that platform to somebody that actually does understand and they're really good at sharing that experience, you know. And I'm really heavy on that because one of the things that this annoyed me a lot at work, and I don't want to say I want to let me try and see if I can do this, put this really vaguely, sometimes there'll be writers or editors that will write stories about, like, the black experience, almost in the lens of blackness.

Without being clear about the fact that they're not black and they'll get paid and get the commission for it when there's more than capable Writers that understand that experience fully that would be able to write it and usually they won't be politically orientated Obviously they will be like beauty stories like and then you haven't you haven't implied That you're not a black writer and you're telling me about all the best of something for a black woman Which one did you try?

And how would you know that it does do that? That really annoys me. And that's one of the reasons why I don't like taking space that doesn't belong to me. Because I get annoyed when people do that to our spaces.

Camille: Yeah, for sure. So speaking actually of, like, needing to have an opinion, or people wanting you to have an opinion, And you've kind of mentioned like wanting to only take space that belongs to you and like you already fit in. And so a lot of your own like story and experiences do end up in your work. And so I'd imagine a lot of times.

When like a big event happens or maybe like even like a new product is coming out and you have to contribute to the dialogue early on, but you're not really sure how things are going to shake out and I think right now, especially with cancel culture being very real. It is kind of risky to, make a comment on something when you're like, wait, where did everyone land?

Are we, are we pro or are we con? Are we like for or against? And so how do you plan for that? And, if you can create a balance, how do you protect your piece essentially? 

Shei: I love that question. This is such a good question because that is something that I also had to learn with experience a little bit.

So I recently wrote a story about, uh, the Fenty Beauty hair salon who had a little bit of backlash when they came to the UK and did an activation. And then there was some black women that weren't super happy with the, with the treatment of the hair. Listen, I am Navy. I am team Navy to the core, to the bone.

Like My blood runs navy. So for me to say anything mildly, mildly, hmm, sus about Queen Riri, it hurts my heart because I feel like we're family. But I also have journalistic integrity and that's really important. And I think that like women that I aspire to be like, and they admire, and that I'm a fan of, I, I don't know them personally.

God willing, Soon come will be besties. I don't know her, these people personally, but I assume from the, the people that I want to respect that I respect, even I would like to think that they believe in like fair conversations and journalists think integrity and like having open dialogue. Right. So I feel like if I were to criticize in a constructive way, anything to do with their brand or their business, AKA is not personal, then they would take that and I think that is really admirable that I, that I, you know, took a shot into doing that in the most respectful kind of way.

So when I wrote the story, when I, when I was writing the story, I obviously asked the brand for comment and I was so anxious, but I was very clear about the fact that like my priority is making sure that like I validate black woman's experiences. Number one, number two, that I have journalistic integrity to everything that I do.

I want to be a respected journalist. I don't want to be a gossip journalist. I want to be somebody that. You know, right stuff that matters are important and that are true. And number three, I want to be fair, like, and I want to be constructive. So then you guys carry on thriving and your business is celebrated the way that it should be because you've done so much for us.

Right? So I just realized that I don't care. Like, I just don't care. Every story that I've written that is mildly controversial, the brands have come back to me and they were like, how can we fix this? And this has happened with Amazon, Amazon hair salon. And I kind of like, if you read that, I didn't even know they had a hair salon girl. It was a hot mess, my experience. And I wrote all about it.

it was a lot. It was on Apple News for a week, . Um, it was trending. It was crazy. So go read it. I love. But you know, they, at the end of the day, like they fixed things.

Everyone has been so everybody that I've. Sort of given not everybody that being constructed, not everybody, not every brand, but most brands that I'm, that I was originally passionate about and then had to proceed to give constructive criticism for has then come back to me in a constructive way and saying that they maybe felt something or something was misconstrued.

How can we fix it? And they were very open to my opinion. And that's all that matters. That means I've done my job. That was the whole point is the whole point is not to catch people and make people go bankrupt. That sucks, especially Businesses that are actually were trying to do something for us in the first place.

So like I would never want. people to think feel any kind of way about Fenty because honestly the work that they've done the good stuff that they've done completely outweighs the bad experience that a handful of black women had but that doesn't take away from the fact that those experiences need to be validated.

It should have been from, it should have been zero, you know, but that we could always say about that, that about anything, nothing is perfect. But if we having those conversations, we can reduce those things happening, you know? Yeah. Yeah. I hope I answered your question. I feel like I kind of got lost, but I feel, I feel like my, my point is I don't care.

Camille: Yeah, no, it does answer because I, the main thing was like, I wanted to know how you basically decide to still move forward and not be so stressed about what you have to say or what the backlash might be and I really I feel like it's like You're you have your morals you have your boundaries you have your standards and you stick by those and so at the end of the Day, you're like, well, I Did what I said and, um, maintain my journalistic integrity.

I told the truth and, that's all I can ask. And then you're okay with, you know, a potential negative thing where, maybe the brand, is upset with you and no more free samples, but then you're like, okay, that, that brand wasn't for me, you know, 

Shei: exactly, exactly. I wouldn't want a brand that would do that.

That's a brand that I will never want to work with anyway. So you actually just made my life so much easier because now I don't ever have to think about you again. I don't have to feature any of your products again. But for the most part, I feel like my experience has been that, like, the fact that I don't care enough about being, Somebody's like being the lapdog of the industry, you know, the person that licks everybody's ass.

I don't care enough for that. I feel like that's helped me be more, be better at my job. So, 

Camille: yeah. And speaking of that, actually, I think one of the things. Actually, I don't know if it's really speaking of that.

Anyway. Anyways, another note. On a completely unrelated note.

One of the things I think you've done so well is maintain a balance and still kind of have fun in your life. work. So like one day you're literally writing about Black Lives Matter and like the next day you're filming TikTok videos with Gwen Stefani. And so. From what I can tell you, you never stray away from the tough topics, but you also don't let yourself get boxed into like, oh, I only do social commentary pieces.

And so, especially now being freelance where you do have a little bit more control, how do you make the decision on what to cover and when? And is this like pretty easy or do people only kind of like start reaching out to you for certain things and you're like, wait, wait, wait, I can do this too. 

Shei: Yeah, it's a bit, definitely a bit of both.

Um, I mean, you've, I've, I mean, you answered your own question. Like, I literally want to have fun and I also feel like that, you know, we're not a monolith as women, as Black women, right? So, like, I feel like my career, my, um, bylines represent that perfectly. Like, they represent all sides and edges to my existence as a Black woman or to my existence as me, as Shea, right?

So that is like the simplest way to put it. Like I write about things that I'm passionate about and things that excite me in the moment. And sometimes I get excited about lipsticks. Sometimes I get excited about a really great movie. Sometimes I get excited about You know, like my favorite artist

and sometimes I care about the fact that like black women are not getting paid the same as, you know, their counterparts and that is our existence. And it, it, it represents, like my CV represents me as a person so well to the point that sometimes I have to remind myself that I am not my CV. like. Because I guess, Gary, if you start mixing, like, if you start making your existence based on like the work that you've done, but because it's so representative of like all the things that are important to me and all the things that I enjoy it.

It makes me happy. It brings me joy. And now that I'm freelance, I'm able to do that a little bit more. And then people do come to me now based on the fact that like, I mean, most of the commissions that I get that are coming from outside coming in, are based on like black woman experience for sure like I don't think I've branched out enough that I'm not writing about black experiences.

involuntary, like, um, but I want to get to a point where people can reach out to me and they're like, Hey, like, there's this really cool, fun thing about this fun stuff. I'm starting to get lots of things on snowboarding, but like I was having some conversations with some big dogs in snowboarding industry being like, Shei, you are such a talented writer.

I can't wait until you start writing about snowboarding and it doesn't involve DEI. And honestly, I hate What? Wait. No, because they were like, you are writing, your writing is so good, but you're getting boxed. Be careful. And that shook me because at first I was like, because I don't want, I don't want to be boxed either.

And actually, I would love to start writings, um, to doing more like interviews and stuff and write, but then people are not going to commission me that for that because they look at me and all they see is diversity and inclusion. So like, I want to get to a place where, you know, these people were right.

They, you know, 

Camille: Yeah, you can 

be, you can be a writer first and not a black writer. 

Shei: Yeah. And like, even my peers, even like my snowboardy friends, they were like, that was what I've read so many snowboarding articles in my lifetime. This was one of the best, funnest snowboarding And they were like, it would be really cool for you to start writing, you know, just general stuff.

And I was like, so I'm getting this from like both ends. And I agree. But then I'm like, tell your peers that. Because I'm not the one that is like, doing the commissioning. So 

yeah. 

Camille: Okay. What has been your favorite article or piece that you've done so far? 

Shei: Impossible to rate. 

Camille: Most recent, most recent. In the last year. 

Shei: That is if like, that is like picking your favorite child. Like, you know, like I'm trying to think of like, Oh my God. 

Camille: Um, most impactful, 

like, let me choose a different action.

Shei: I'm going to tell you a couple of ones that like change things for me a little bit. Yeah, yeah. My first article at British Vogue was an interview with Megan Thee Stallion, and it was just after she'd had Lanez. And the only reason why I secured that article, that's not the only reason why I secured that article, but like securing, securing that interview in the first place.

came from a place of me complaining to a brand about something negative that they'd done to me. So like, as in like, to me as a writer, a black writer, like, I feel like they were like sharing a bunch of articles and they would always hug the writer and they shared a bunch of my articles, didn't tag me in any capacity.

And like, it just went into the abyss. And then this was like during black lives matter. I just got made redundant from the Sunday times. It was a dark time. Okay. It was dark. Okay. We were in the pits of hell and I was like, okay, this, I was so jaded, so angry. I wrote this super angry email to a PR agency about how they just failed me so poorly and like how this is so, it was just so gnarly for me to go through that at that time because I was like, I'm literally jobless.

I don't know how I'm going to pay my rent next month. And me now as a freelancer, it really helps if you like, Tag me or say who the writer of the article that featured your product is like you do everybody else if they didn't do it for anybody else that would be like fine that's like their structure and their like vibe but like it was just me so it was giving It was, it was giving dodgy.

So then because they were like, what can we do to make up for this? I was like, you can give me an interview with Megan Thee Stallion, and I'm going to pitch it to Vogue, and then we're going to get that through. And that's what happened. And I kind of, That is 

Camille: wild. 

Shei: It was so crazy because I'd never written for British Vogue before, it was a year into my career, a year, like, what writer can say that they wrote for British Vogue after one year of writing, and barely, I'd had about probably three articles at the Sunday Times prior to that, so my fourth or fifth article ever was at British Vogue.

And Like, so that was like super impactful and like definitely changed the trajectory of my career because then other people had seen it and then like kind of led me to going to Glamour. Um, when I did.

Trying to think of another one that was like impactful for me. Um, so like my mind's gone blank, but like my celebrity interviews are, oh my gosh, every time I do a celebrity interview, I guess so, I feel so like, I don't know, like, it's a feeling of like adrenaline that rushes through me. I remember when I spoke to Tracy Ellis Ross, She was like, I'm obsessed with you. You're the funniest person I need to meet or your life. And when she came to Europe, I got the call and I was the first, we went, we had like a luncheon.

And I was the first person to be introduced to her because she specifically asked to speak to me. That's wild. And then, imagine Tracee In an 

Camille: honor. 

Shei: Honor for her. Honor for her, period. One of the funniest women in Hollywood to tell you that you're funny. I'm surprised my head gets through those these days.

I'm always surprised. Like, yeah. So like, celebrity interviews are so much fun. I love them because I love connecting with people. Um, and 

Camille: No, I was 

literally going to ask your top three celebrities you've interviewed. 

Shei: Okay, let me answer your other question before then. I will say that non celebrity related stories that I've written that I feel passionate about, um, that I thought were important.

Um, I feel like that Fenty story was quite important because it was like the first time that I'd written a story. That might have not made the brand that I love the most happy with me. It was like a risk. Right. Right. And I Right. I, I, I appreciated that, trusting myself to take the risk and I appreciated that, trusting myself that I was doing a, a service to the industry.

Mm-Hmm. . So that was important. I thought. Thought that was good. Um, when I wrote about, um, the u uh, the Ukraine War and the, and the borders and the black experience there and how like. I was, I spoke to this girl who was, who took her days to get out of Ukraine because of the racism she was experiencing at the border.

And, yeah, that was really tough, like, we cried on the phone, like, And it was a controversial piece to write at the time because people didn't want to surround the conversation around these people that were clearly going through the worst thing ever. And then having to write something that is kind of like, that can make them look any kind of way was again a risk that I decided to take.

And I feel like it paid off because those stories need to be told too and I feel like I need to speak about the Black experience and that's what I'm going to do. So that was like one and then when I look back on it I don't think my writing was like the best but I think it was like an important story to tell and it performed super well for traffic and there was a lot of negative comments and there was a lot of people saying that what I was claiming was fake like I'm deciphering word for word somebody's experience so like I don't you can't tell me something it's their experience is fake

Camille: yeah. 

So I'll put those 

links in the, in the show notes. 

Shei: So yeah, those two, those stories I think are been important to me. 

Camille: Love it. And like, honestly. No, no, your list is like, is so impressive. So it's, it's, um, I assume a lot of people who will potentially listen to this live in the U S and are maybe not the most like tapped in. And so they probably don't know your work as well.

So it's good for them to know, like, what you've done. 

Shei: Yeah. I've written over, I would say like over 800 articles in my career in the past, like five years, I'd say. So like, I don't really know, like, What's out there 

anymore? I

 hope most of them are good. 

Camille: They are. Um, okay, top three favorite people you've interviewed.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Trying to hear some name drops. Some additional name drops. 

Shei: Super hard, but say Tracy, Tracy Ellis Rostrick because she made me feel so good about speaking to her, you know, somebody just feels like she made me feel like it was an honor for her to speak to me and I'm like, wow, that's really powerful and beautiful.

And maybe she and I feel like that is a personality. She feels she makes other people feel like that too. But I'm like, that's really special and really hard to do. I love speaking to Sweetie. Again, it was because she just made me feel like a home girl. Like, I remember at the end of the interview, I was like, she was saying, she was like, Are you in London right now?

And I was like, Yes. And she was like, I want to go to London so bad. And I was like, I live in Brixton, we have a couch. So like, if you ever come pull up, I'll set up the couch for you. 

Camille: Now you 

offering your couch to Sweetie. 

Shei: She was like, I'm there. Yeah, we haven't made it happen yet. I've moved outta London now, but if she ever wants to come to Lisbon, I also have a couch.

We'll make it work. . 

Camille: I do have a different 

couch. 

Shei: I have a different couch. But it's still available. Yeah. And it's like longer and wider. So like, and the weather's better too. So like I feel like she'll enjoy it. She looks great in a bikini, so like she can go to the pool. You know? I feel like she'll have a good time here.

So like she, 

Camille: I, no, but 

for real, I think she really would like. You would show her around. 

Shei: We would have a great time. I felt like I was talking to my home girl. Love her. And like, I don't know, like a lot of celebrities, they, they feel like they have to be, um, obviously super nice to journalists because obviously we make or break their careers, but like, it's very easy to see through that when you, when people are.

And with her it just wasn't the case cause people say, don't meet your heroes. And like, I'd be meeting these people and I'm like, you are living, you're living up to everything that I thought about you good on you.

I was like, this is so awesome that these people that don't know me from nothing, sit there for an hour or so with me or two hours, and then they decide that they like me.

And they're sincere about it. Um Gwen Stefani was cool because that was crazy because I remember being like, I don't know, like nine and then dancing in front of the TV to like all her, like, we would, me and my sister.

Hollaback Girl. Hollaback Girl, we would record in, remember the video cassettes, the VCR? Mm hmm. We would record our music videos on MTV Bass. on the cassettes and then we would obviously replay over and over again and dance in front of the tv and you know kiki and to go full circle where i'm meeting her and then i remember when i went to the shoot it was me and my bed sorry that's my phone it was in my how can i stop this from happening you 

Camille: gotta be less popular 

Shei: because now they're gonna keep messaging now i think oh i can mute

How do I close it? Okay, I closed it. 

Camille: I guess when you were nine, it was probably no doubt. I don't know if she went solo yet. Had she? Um, Maybe? 

Shei: I can't remember, but I think that, I think that she got poppin when she did, um, I can't remember now. I feel like those years kind of all blurred into one, you know?

Yeah. Um, but yeah, so she, when we got to the interview, there was me and then two other girls. Shout out to Luca and Chrissy. They are my work wives and my forever work wives, even though we don't work together. And they're like some of my closest friends in life. And they are beautiful black women too. And They came in, one of them does social, the other one does production, and then IWFC was doing the interview, and they were running the show, making all these old white men, not old white men, but these big white men run around, making sure the cameras is fixed, you do this, you do that, da da da da da, just in our boss girl energy.

And then Gwen was like, sitting there watching us like, at work. So she just literally stopped us in our tracks and she was like, Can I just say, you guys are so impressive, like, I wanna know how you even got here, like, how did you get to do this? How did you get here? And I was like, for her to sit there and be interested in our life stories, I love that.

And then we were there with Sephora, so then the team at Sephora, um, shout out to Arietta, um, she's really supportive of me and she, um, she's a big dog at Sephora, although I don't know if she's still there, but yeah, she was like, she got here because she's, A bad B. That's why. Look at her. She's got a go.

And then, and then Gwen was like, I can see like, yeah, like, these, these girls are so impressive. And then we were telling her our stories and she was like, wow. And then I was like, that is so awesome that you care enough to know about where I come from. And you excited to hear about me being here when I'm excited to be here. Like, I, I didn't feel like we were doing anything impressive. This was just our day to day. And she made us feel like, important and impressive. And I think that's cool because she didn't have to do that again. This was off the record. No cameras were rolling, like, she literally was like, before we start, like, how did you get here?

You guys are so impressive. Wow. You should be really proud of yourself. That's what I was like. 

Camille: Thank you. I love that. And it really emphasizes like how rare that is because she's had a long career. She's been doing stuff like this for probably over 30 years and she's been pretty relevant the majority of that time.

So it's not like, Oh, you know, she, she only did a couple of things here and then a couple like she has been in the game. And so for her to say that and just like really notice it's like one. Like this is rare and it doesn't happen often, but it also is like, hello, you're doing something like, you're like the best of the best, which is really awesome for her to like, say that because she could have definitely been it.

Like noted it and then maybe said it to someone later and you never hear about it. So it's really cool that you actually got to interact and have that moment. 

Shei: And then I also realized that she probably hasn't experienced seeing so many Black people. And by so many Black people, I mean three Black women.

On, on internet. And she was just like. Because, um, she probably was just like, wow, this is really cool. I haven't experienced that before. And she is, she works within our industry and she's deep into our culture. So she really understands like what that looks like. So yeah, she was super cool.

Camille: Who would be your dream interview? 

Shei: Oh, that is such an easy question. This is the easiest question you asked me. I have the holy trinity in my vision is Rihanna, Beyonce and Michelle Obama.

And I've been very close to Rihanna into Michelle, like super close. But I haven't made it work yet, but they are in the cards. So yeah. 

Camille: Okay. I love that. We're manifesting. 

Shei: Let me know. Let me know when it's happening. Yeah, I will. You'll be the first to know. Don't worry. You know this already. You're the first to know about many of the ones.

So yeah. 

Camille: I know. I, it was fun. Like hearing you talk about the articles and I'm like, I remember that one. I remember you asking experience about this one. I remember this one. It's cool to just. Like get a little recap of your career when I was like, oh, yeah, that was Like early on or yeah, that was a big deal 

Shei: Yeah, yeah And at the time you remember you you know, I I was bouncing off ideas of you I'm asking your opinion on it or quotes and stuff like that.

So yeah, you were there for a lot of it. So yeah, 

Camille: yeah Um, okay real quick anything That you want to add that we haven't discussed yet. Oh 

Shei: Um well, actually we We haven't spoken about like my new venture, which is snowboarding that much. Oh, 

Camille: I was going to ask you what is your most expected side quest so far?

Because for me, to you, it is this. Because I remember, yes, because I remember, I mean, I knew you grew up like always being active and athletic and all that. So that part of it wasn't a surprise. But then when you said you're quitting your job to become a professional snowboarder, Wait, I 

Shei: wasn't, it wasn't like that was exact.

It wasn't like that exact wording. 

Camille: It was pretty close to that. And like, I need to. So, I think, I think I was shocked. And I was like, okay, like that's cool. But I remember telling my family, because you know my family, and being like, oh, they're like, oh, how's Shei? And I was like, oh, she's quitting her job to become a professional snowboarder.

Everyone was shook. When you don't even live by snow, that was crazy.

Shei: What's so funny? Like, all of my friends that have, that I know their parents, I've had those exact same conversations. It was the exact same response. And then they're, they're fighting for their lives to protect me and my feelings to their parents and their siblings being like, no, you don't know her.

She'd be great. 

Camille: Which like, I just have to contextualize because you made this decision. I think, I feel like you'd been snowboarding like once.

Shei: Lies. It was like, at least three times. At least. And two of the times it was like, over a period of days. 

Camille: That is so funny. 

Shei: By the time I made the decision, I was on day eight. I'll tell you that.

Camille: But yeah, it's like you made that announcement and I was like, dang, and then here you are doing it. Like, it's so, it's so awesome. 

Shei: I'm the way that like, I, I am a God fearing woman and, but the way I manifested this into my life needs to be written because I literally knew at the time that I was being the Lulu, But I knew that was the solution.

And a year on, I have two articles, two print articles, both of them, one of them is 15 pages, one is 17 pages, to some of the biggest snowboarding magazines on the planet, on print, talking about my best friends, who are now part of my crew, we're called TDI, can you see the little repping? Oh 

Camille: yeah, I didn't 

Shei: realize you thought was that.

Um, and they are the most talented black and brown snowboarders on the planet. And we are traveling the world together. We are getting big sponsors. We are working on like a documentary, a snowboard movie. We are really doing the damn thing where these are guys that are going to be at the Olympics and the, at the X games and stuff like that.

And I get to be part of that experience, even though obviously I'm not in the level that they're at. And I'm like helping, you know, I'm getting, I help the team with comms. and essentially want to, I'm like that brain outside of snowboarding, because the snowboarding part, they've got it locked down because they're so talented.

They've got the connections in their work in building, but like, we want to do what kind of like the skaters managed to do, what the Formula One riders managed to do, which is like branch house, even the surfers like to branch out outside of the sport and like be able to make a living off it. And.

Snowboarding is obviously a very niche sport, and it's also very, uh, like, white, and we are everything that snowboarding doesn't look like, and we are doing pretty good, and like, I'm really excited about, like, our plans and our future, and I said this time, this time last year, almost to today, Because I remember it was after my birthday when I, when I quit my job and I literally was like, I really want to find a community first of all in snowboarding.

I want to write in snowboarding. I want to do presenting and I want to travel the world. And I've done three out of the four things that I wanted to do in less than 12 months. And even the presenting thing, I'm working on that. Like, this is something, these are conversations that are happening right now.

Like, in this exact moment. So to be able to say that, that within 12 months I managed to do Something that was at the time felt completely unachievable for the closest people in my life like you are so close to me like your family opinion matters to me and I knew that I was crazy because you, y'all, your parents were not the only parents to say that to me and sibling.

And, but for some reason, everybody that came to me they were like, you know what, like, I'm somehow someway I feel like you're gonna pull this out of the bag. I don't know how, but I just feel like you will. And honestly that kept me going. So thank you friends and family because without y'all like, I don't know if I would have been here because like that is all good and dandy having that determination, that tenacity.

And that discipline but like having the support system to help you through that those days that I didn't want to get up and having my sister being like, well, those dreams are not going to make themselves happen. 

Camille: Those, 

Shei: those conversations made a difference. And I'm nowhere near anywhere that I want this side quest to go like this side quest is starting to become a bit of a main quest, not gonna lie, but like, It is very much a main quest at this stage, but like, I feel like for the time being, I've done the thing.

A hundred percent. So now we're just gonna jump onto the level number, what am I on? Like seven or eight? I don't know, like, the final boss is a long, long way to go, but like, yeah. Yeah. 

Camille: Yeah. Yeah. Exciting. Okay, last question that I'm asking everyone at the end of their episode this season. So what keeps you up at night?

Industry or otherwise. Child. 

Shei: Um, uh, The anxiety. of failure, potential failure, whatever that looks like, especially in the last couple of weeks when the stakes have just become higher. And so many parts of my personal life and my, um, career, um, life, my professional life, there's been mornings that I've woken up that I've self felt Oh, like what if this doesn't work?

Oh, yeah, so like that definitely keeps me up at night But not every night is getting better like it's ebbs and flows sometimes when i'm too busy This is the thing the season is about to start all my summer activities. I've kind of finished And this is like a very weird, awkward time. And there's two times of the year that have been awkward for me this past year.

It was just after spring where everything kind of stopped in my life. I wasn't skating. I wasn't snowboarding. Didn't have, my only side quest was crocheting, but even that. You know, I was getting into a rut about it. I wasn't working because work was slow. So then I got into like an anxiety hole. And then I'm in the exact same place now.

And I know that this is because of the time of the year. I've now come to realize. time of the year because it's a seasonal thing. So I know that I'm going to experience that and I just need to be able next time around, I'm just need to be able to manage it a bit better. Um, I think that that depends of like when you ask, but like, yeah, anxiety or failure for this particular time in my life.

Camille: Um, well,

it's been so great talking with you. Thank you for coming on the pod. Um, and I just want to go back to like, we met. I don't know if you would call this one of your side quests, but like, we met. At the Olympics in Rio volunteering and we just like really hit it off and I think we were only together for like four, four days, four or five days and just like really hit it off spending so much of the day together and it was just so fun.

Like an amazing experience. Yeah. Oh my gosh. 

Shei: But like we were together for 20 hours straight 

Camille: every day. Yeah. Cause we were not, we were not sleeping. We were not sleeping. At all. Um, there was no time. No. But I remember you, there was one time we were like on the little subway thing, and you were so, you were like, it's been so great getting to know you, because our trip was wrapping up.

And you're like, and it's so hard to keep up these long distance friendships, because I was in LA, you were in London, we met in Brazil. So you're like, it's just not realistic to be texting all the time, because, you know, it's hard and we just met. And so you're like, but I really want to stay in contact, like, let's.

Check in in December. We'll each write a letter of what's been happening in like a few months since and then I was like that is so genius because I have had friendships like kind of like Spark and then it like dies because we like hey, how are you? Oh good. How are you? And there's not that much to talk about because you're not in each other's lives But, first of all, genius idea, but also I think, um, know that I would have said anything that directly to you even, at the time, even though I was like, wow, this is really awesome to meet you.

And so, I'm just grateful for, for you being, being you, and, like, making stuff happen, including, And it's just been like, so amazing to just be part of your community and for you to be part of mine and, um, for it to continue to grow over the years and you getting to know like my family and my friends and everything.

And so, um, I feel, I feel blessed. I feel special and I feel grateful and I'm, I'm very proud of, like, everything that you, all your side quests and your main quests, but mostly just, like, you're a great friend and I'm, I'm glad to be associated in any way. 

Shei: Oh, Mil, this is, like, the best. Thank you so much. And I was gonna say this, like, that was, like, the other thing that I was gonna say, like, It's so funny how, like, people in my life know you and know Lani, who I met through you, um, as, like, my really, really good friends, like, my for my for lifers, my future bridesmaids.

And, like, it's just funny because we, yeah, we've never lived in the same country together, and we don't spend any more than maybe two weeks together. And, Lani lived in London together for a year, but even then, we were so busy, we didn't get to see each other all the time. But our Friendship blossomed in such a beautiful way that I just feel like I can tell you guys everything and I do tell you guys everything and we can overshare and there's no judgment and you've shared all your community with me.

And I just feel like now I have all these extension, extended family and extended friends that like I would have never met or interacted with in any capacity had I not met you guys. So really thankful for that. And like. you have an awesome like spirit and like everyone around you also has that because you attract like really beautiful energy.

So then I'm just really lucky to be able to like be in that circle, you know? So thanks friend. I appreciate it. Um, obviously Lani is like first guest in this podcast. So like shout out to her. If you haven't listened to it yet, go. 

Camille: Yeah. So now everyone's getting connected. Um, I'm like, honestly. Listening to this podcast is just one way to get to know, like, my friends.

Like, that's, like, what's happening here.

Um, but yeah, thank you so much. 

Shei: No, thank you. 

Camille: And hopefully this was helpful too for, for who, anyone who needs it. 

Shei: Yeah, hopefully. And yeah, people, if y'all want to get in touch about any advice to do with journalism or sidequesting. I'm going to be a pro, uh, a pro in that as well.

Um, yeah, hit, hit me up. Like I always want to pass it forward. There was been amazing people, incredible people that have helped me to get to this stage. And I would love to be that person with someone else. Thank you. Thanks. Bye friend.

Camille: Thanks for tuning in to my conversation with Shei. If you want to keep up with her, you can find her social media accounts in the show notes.

Please subscribe to the show anywhere you get your podcasts and leave a review to let me know what you think. You can also get updates on guests, episode releases, and more by following the show on Instagram at hold the door pod. 

I'll see you next time. I'll be back next week to discuss relocating for work. I'll be back next week to discuss relocating for work. See you then.